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Thread: Bajans.. hmph

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    where de crix Oneshot's Avatar Oneshot is offline
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    Bajans.. hmph

    The Nation Newspaper | 100 Chinese working on Four Seasons Resort

    ABOUT 100 CHINESE are working on the new Four Seasons Resort complex in Black Rock, St Michael.

    This was disclosed yesterday during the official stone-laying ceremony by principal developer Mike Pemberton, who revealed they were employed through China State Construction Company.

    Pemberton thanked Chief Immigration Officer Gilbert Greaves for facilitating the importation of labour for the Clearwater-Paradise site.

    "I want to thank the chief immigration officer for allowing us to bring in the China State Construction Company [workers in] large enough [numbers] that we can start this first phase," he said.

    While he could not give an exact figure of how many Barbadians were employed with the project, he outlined several areas where local workers dominated.

    "The people in the corporate offices are all Barbadian. The Chinese are only on the construction here but every truck driver is a Barbadian, all the drivers of all the equipment are Barbadian."

    Pemberton added that Barbados' low unemployment rate and fast pace of development made it necessary to bring in foreign workers.

    "The unemployment rate in Barbados is six or seven per cent," he said. "You can never in the world, no matter where you are, have zero unemployment. The problem is Barbados is growing so fast you've got no option."

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    Registered User iPicong's Avatar iPicong is offline
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    Same thing happening in Trinidad. The construction industry is booming and they have a labor shortage (well dats wat they say). Maybe they should be training locals to do these jobs that they importing foreigners to do. Its very difficult to even find a decent contractor to build a house in Trinidad.
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    Registered User Rinababy's Avatar Rinababy is offline
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    That is some bullshit I'm sorry but if there are no bajans to do the job, which im sure there are they could have opened up immigration WITHIN the Caribbean region to fill those positions. I swear our mentality is so facked up.

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    Strength & amp; amp; a mp; Endurance AxAeo's Avatar AxAeo is offline
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    This type of thing is a massive problem in Anguilla where we have several large projects going on (Namely Viceroy and Temenos) and several workers have been imported and are residing in poor quality trailer homes. I was on a bike ride in the west of the island (where the projects are) early morning and most of the Filipino works were out on walks with their phones - I presume calling home.

    The problem is that governments are too blinded by money to realize we need to take things slow, rely on local labour, take a stand and not let foreign investors push us around (We need them, but WE should tell THEM what to do - not them tell us what their going to) and ensure that our development is sustainable. This is the thing ALL Caribbean governments need to learn and soon - Otherwise we'll all end up like Haiti.

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    Gangsta Boogie Bake n Shark's Avatar Bake n Shark is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rinababy View Post
    That is some bullshit I'm sorry but if there are no bajans to do the job, which im sure there are they could have opened up immigration WITHIN the Caribbean region to fill those positions. I swear our mentality is so facked up.
    You display an incredible lack of appreciation for the dynamics within the industry. I don't see what's so 'facked' up about it. We don't complain too much when big NA companies outsource labor to India in hope of a wider profit margin, or to cut costs legitimately..why? b/c we the consumer benefits.

    As AJB said...the same thing is happening in TnT....much to my surprise, when I visited. I was told that many young able bodied men aren't interested, or skilled enough in the trades to work in construction. There are many factors at play and all of them may affect cost. Wage aside, there's the issue of skill...having to teach workers the craft vs. bringing in skilled workers and having them get up and running immediately. Finishing the project on time is another concern that would be affected by the quality of the workforce.

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    Strength & amp; amp; a mp; Endurance AxAeo's Avatar AxAeo is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bake n Shark View Post
    You display an incredible lack of appreciation for the dynamics within the industry. I don't see what's so 'facked' up about it. We don't complain too much when big NA companies outsource labor to India in hope of a wider profit margin, or to cut costs legitimately..why? b/c we the consumer benefits.

    As AJB said...the same thing is happening in TnT....much to my surprise, when I visited. I was told that many young able bodied men aren't interested, or skilled enough in the trades to work in construction. There are many factors at play and all of them may affect cost. Wage aside, there's the issue of skill...having to teach workers the craft vs. bringing in skilled workers and having them get up and running immediately. Finishing the project on time is another concern that would be affected by the quality of the workforce.
    Just because "Big brother" does it, doesn't me we can do it. It's true we don't complain because we benefit, but that's a US problem - this one is OUR problem and we will complain. Yes, it IS hypocritical, but it's the truth.

    You have a point though - the work ethic of young locals is rather low (Look at my little brother for an example... "Love money, hate wuk") and that's a primary reason they go outside the region for workers. We as a people need to work past this type of mentality... or risk losing the little we have.

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    Gangsta Boogie Bake n Shark's Avatar Bake n Shark is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by AxAeo View Post
    Just because "Big brother" does it, doesn't me we can do it. It's true we don't complain because we benefit, but that's a US problem - this one is OUR problem and we will complain. Yes, it IS hypocritical, but it's the truth.
    Where on earth did I say/insinuate that "just because...."

    Fact of the matter is that it's a business venture and not a social programme. Four Seasons is in Barbados for the same reason every other company is in the caribbean...to make money. That is affected by limiting costs and finishing the project on time...and if there are labor factors that legitimately and significantly enough affect that then I can't argue with it.

    Note that I said 'significantly enough'...not because the Filipinos are cheaper should they be hired...but if local labor costs are too high then this likely is a concession the government has to make so as to make opportunities attractive enough to foreign investment...if not Four Seasons free to pack up and pitch their hotel to some other island. At the end of the day it will likely be Bajans who end up working in and benefitting from the hotel being in Barbados. I certainly ent going to get all up in arms because is some chinee fellas hammering nail in de hot sun.

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    Registered User Ras_Apache is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bake n Shark View Post
    You display an incredible lack of appreciation for the dynamics within the industry. I don't see what's so 'facked' up about it. We don't complain too much when big NA companies outsource labor to India in hope of a wider profit margin, or to cut costs legitimately..why? b/c we the consumer benefits.

    As AJB said...the same thing is happening in TnT....much to my surprise, when I visited. I was told that many young able bodied men aren't interested, or skilled enough in the trades to work in construction. There are many factors at play and all of them may affect cost. Wage aside, there's the issue of skill...having to teach workers the craft vs. bringing in skilled workers and having them get up and running immediately. Finishing the project on time is another concern that would be affected by the quality of the workforce.
    the downside is that by not training local laborers you are increasing the amount of unskilled unemployable people in your country. in the long run, that will lead to more folks relying on crime to make a living. Eventually, you are gonna need to bring in the Chinease police to manage the crime

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    Gangsta Boogie Bake n Shark's Avatar Bake n Shark is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ras_Apache View Post
    the downside is that by not training local laborers you are increasing the amount of unskilled unemployable people in your country. in the long run, that will lead to more folks relying on crime to make a living. Eventually, you are gonna need to bring in the Chinease police to manage the crime
    Nonsense.


    1. You can't force a man to pick up a hammer. I was told of YTEPP (Youth Training and Employment_____ Programme) buildings in TnT that fell into disrepair and had to be demolished because there were no youths enrolled for training in certain parts of the country. Why learn trade when you can become a wanna-be knucklehead and part-time gangsta?

    2. No on is saying that these fellas are unskilled or unemployable. The caribbean region is among the world leaders in terms of highest population literacy rates anywhere in the world. The problem isn't that these fellas dunce...the problem is that they too facking bright fuh dey own good.

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    Registered User Ras_Apache is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bake n Shark View Post
    Nonsense.


    1. You can't force a man to pick up a hammer. I was told of YTEPP (Youth Training and Employment_____ Programme) buildings in TnT that fell into disrepair and had to be demolished because there were no youths enrolled for training in certain parts of the country. Why learn trade when you can become a wanna-be knucklehead and part-time gangsta?

    2. No on is saying that these fellas are unskilled or unemployable. The caribbean region is among the world leaders in terms of highest population literacy rates anywhere in the world. The problem isn't that these fellas dunce...the problem is that they too facking bright fuh dey own good.
    As AJB said...the same thing is happening in TnT....much to my surprise, when I visited. I was told that many young able bodied men aren't interested, or skilled enough in the trades to work in construction

    i guess the person that told you that was NO ON

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    Registered User The Captain's Avatar The Captain is offline
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    Just another case of Barbados-China economic relations. It seems to becoming the norm these days.

    http://www.cbc.bb/content/view/11211/10/

    Barbados seeking closer ties with China


    Friday, 08 June 2007
    Barbados will soon have a diplomatic and commercial presence in the People's Republic of China which should strengthen relations between the two countries.

    This is one of a number of initiatives discussed during official talks between Barbados' Prime Minister, Owen Arthur, and Premier of the State Council of the People's Republic of China, Wen Jiaboa, at the Great Hall of the People in Beijing, China.

    Barbados could also benefit from increased cooperation in education since, in addition to the continued provision of scholarships, China has offered to send teachers to Barbados.

    Mr. Arthur, who is on an official visit to China in celebration of 30 years of diplomatic relations

    The Prime Minister also reaffirmed Barbados' commitment to the 'one China policy' and encouraged the Asian nation to develop closer relations with countries in the region and by extension, Caricom.

    Last Updated ( Fri, Jun 08 2007 )

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    Gangsta Boogie Bake n Shark's Avatar Bake n Shark is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ras_Apache View Post
    As AJB said...the same thing is happening in TnT....much to my surprise, when I visited. I was told that many young able bodied men aren't interested, or skilled enough in the trades to work in construction

    i guess the person that told you that was NO ON
    They said these guys don't have construction skills....that's a very far cry from saying that they are "unskilled and unemployable".

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    Registered User Ras_Apache is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bake n Shark View Post
    They said these guys don't have construction skills....that's a very far cry from saying that they are "unskilled and unemployable".
    what i said is that if the people go untrained and neglected for cheaper chiney wuk den de natives will become unskilled and unemployable teefs.
    they should atleast hire the local trinis to be laborers.....carry in de sand bags, mix cement, hold nail while chiney hammers....

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    Strength & amp; amp; a mp; Endurance AxAeo's Avatar AxAeo is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bake n Shark View Post
    Where on earth did I say/insinuate that "just because...."

    Fact of the matter is that it's a business venture and not a social programme. Four Seasons is in Barbados for the same reason every other company is in the caribbean...to make money. That is affected by limiting costs and finishing the project on time...and if there are labor factors that legitimately and significantly enough affect that then I can't argue with it.

    Note that I said 'significantly enough'...not because the Filipinos are cheaper should they be hired...but if local labor costs are too high then this likely is a concession the government has to make so as to make opportunities attractive enough to foreign investment...if not Four Seasons free to pack up and pitch their hotel to some other island. At the end of the day it will likely be Bajans who end up working in and benefitting from the hotel being in Barbados. I certainly ent going to get all up in arms because is some chinee fellas hammering nail in de hot sun.
    Yes, it's a business venture... And I'm not too upset about the imported workers, I'm more upset that the government of my island approved TWO MASSIVE foreign projects before it established a measly 2 year moratorium on large developments...

    And you have a point, we need to make it lucrative to foreign investors. But for Anguilla at least (I don't know about Barbados) we're a hot item. Anguilla is the new spot for developing your villa or making a new luxury hotel ("St. Barths, Anguilla, anywhere I chill", says Timbaland) But the government is an organization that needs to look after the people of it's nation, first and foremost, not the interests of foreign investors.

    Also there is the issue of social detriment due to immigrant workers (This is my other problem with the government - Economic development at the cost of social development, leading to crime rates and moral decay.) When my grandfather was in Aruba working in an oil refinery, they brought in a large amount of Jamaican workers. For the time they were there (3 months) the crime rate tripled - and dropped back down when they left. Whether it was the immigrants being robbed or robbing or anything like that doesn't matter - short term immigration does not benefit the host country.

    Long post short - Government's gotta care for Number 1, and Number 1 is always the people of the country.

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    Registered User Rinababy's Avatar Rinababy is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bake n Shark View Post
    You display an incredible lack of appreciation for the dynamics within the industry. I don't see what's so 'facked' up about it. We don't complain too much when big NA companies outsource labor to India in hope of a wider profit margin, or to cut costs legitimately..why? b/c we the consumer benefits.
    First off MANY people have and continue to complain about outsourcing so i don't know where you're getting that from......
    As AJB said...the same thing is happening in TnT....much to my surprise, when I visited. I was told that many young able bodied men aren't interested, or skilled enough in the trades to work in construction. There are many factors at play and all of them may affect cost. Wage aside, there's the issue of skill...having to teach workers the craft vs. bringing in skilled workers and having them get up and running immediately. Finishing the project on time is another concern that would be affected by the quality of the workforce.
    Secondly if you read what I said my issue wasn't so much abput importing foreign workers as it was the fact that they could have imported foreign, skilled labor from WITHIN the region first. Before going outside the region. Im sure there are enough skilled workers from within the Caribbean who are seeking work.

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