Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 17
Like Tree3Likes

Thread: Lord Nelson says he is the King of Soca....

  1. #1
    STEADY WUK Colors's Avatar Colors is offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    DEEP IN THE SOUTH
    Posts
    3,581
    Credits
    75,602,066

    Lord Nelson says he is the King of Soca....

    Here Lord Nelson talks about creating the genre of Soca, meeting The Mighty Sparrow by mistake, who helped start Nello’s career. He also touches on being left out of national Calypso competitions held during Trinidad’s annual carnival, the initial resistance Soca encountered from calypso (kaiso) greats such as Lord Kitchener, as well as lends his take on the current state of Soca music.

    [IMG][/IMG]


    http://www.banddulu.com/king-soca-speaks/

  2. #2
    Repect Our Soca Pioneers Socapro's Avatar Socapro is offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Soca Island
    Posts
    16,689
    Credits
    887,496,585
    I think Nelson says at 8:45 that he invented the name Soca along with Lord Shorty so at least he reckonises Lord Shorty's involvement in naming the music. Wish he had stated what year that was when they came up with the name if he could remember.

    According to Pelham Goddard, Shorty came up with the name Soca when they were recording his Sweet Music album at KH Studio in 1975.

    Pelham Goddard explains how Shorty came up with the name for Sokah/Soca in 1975


    Pelham describes the advent of soca music, outlining some of the players and factors that had an impact on its emergence. At 3:18 in video Pelham explains how Shorty came up with the name Sokah for the new music meaning the Soul or deeper musical expression of Calypso and it was not American Soul and Calypso as many people mistakenly believe.

    Coincidently Lord Nelson started his professional calypso recording career in 1961 which is the same year that Lord Shorty also started his recording career. Either way Lord Nelson is a major contributor to soca in its early life.

    Here is one of Lord Nelson's early calypso hits from 1963 called "I Got A Itch".

    Lord Nelson - I Got A Itch (1963)


    And here is a version of Nelson's first hit "Garrot Bounce" remade in 1969. Its a fast paced calypso leggo version and the backing band is Milo & the Kings from St. Thomas Virgin Islands.

    Lord Nelson - *Garrot Bounce* (1969)


    And here is an innovative calypso from 1972 with a funky bass line and horns similar to what King Wellington did the follwing year in 1973. Backing is by top Trinidadian band Ron Berridge Orchestra & the March of Dimes Quartette. Track is taken from his 1972 album "This Is Lord Nelson".

    Lord Nelson - Vero (1972)



    And here is annother funky bassline calypso from 1973 with backing again by Ron Berridge Orchestra & the March of Dimes Quartette. Track is taken from his 1973 album "Lord Nelson Again".

    Lord Nelson - Shake Your Neighbor Hand (1973)



    And here is another calypso leggo/jam back classic from Lord Nelson from 1976.
    Backing and arrangement is by Art De Coteau.

    Lord Nelson - La La Jam Back (1976)


    And here is another calypso jam back from Lord Nelson from 1977 again backed by Art De Coteau & his Orchestra.

    Lord Nelson - Ah Ha (1977)
    Catch me as Soca PhD Every Saturday 2-4pm GMT
    On www.GenesisRadio.co.uk (91.6FM);
    Every Tueday 6-8pm & Friday 8-10pm GMT
    On www.HavitLive.co.uk (99.1FM);
    www.facebook.com/socaphd
    email: projampro@yahoo.co.uk

    Hailing from Trinidad & Tobago and very proud of it!!
    Land of Calypso, Steelband, Limbo, Parang, Rapso, Chutney-Soca, Soca, Jamoo, Panjazz and the Biggest, Best & Most Influential Caribbean Carnival in the World with no apology!
    Together We Aspire & Together We Achieve!!

  3. #3
    Repect Our Soca Pioneers Socapro's Avatar Socapro is offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Soca Island
    Posts
    16,689
    Credits
    887,496,585
    And here is when Lord Nelson went soca! Listen to the change in the bass drum beat compared with the other tracks above.

    The year is 1978 and lets keep in mind that Lord Shorty was routinely using this new soca drum beat in his music from 1973. So I don't think Lord Nelson was the first to change the beat and structure of the music, that credit still goes to Lord Shorty but Lord Nelson was a major contributor to soca from 1978 onwards as was Calypso Rose and many other others. 1978 was the year that Soca took off in a big way as it was the year that Lord Kitchener's "Sugar Bum Bum" became a massive international hit!

    This track is arranged by Lord Nelson & Mike Boothman.

    Lord Nelson - Hot, Sweet & Jumpy (1978)



    Now here is "Endless Vibrations" from 1974 featuring the same new soca beat that Shorty introduced to the music the previous year. Arrangement on this track was started by Art De Coteau who was not happy with what Shorty was trying to do with the music so the arrangement had to be finished by Ed Watson.

    Lord Shorty - Endless Vibrations (1974)

    Arranged by Art De Coteau & Ed Watson
    Catch me as Soca PhD Every Saturday 2-4pm GMT
    On www.GenesisRadio.co.uk (91.6FM);
    Every Tueday 6-8pm & Friday 8-10pm GMT
    On www.HavitLive.co.uk (99.1FM);
    www.facebook.com/socaphd
    email: projampro@yahoo.co.uk

    Hailing from Trinidad & Tobago and very proud of it!!
    Land of Calypso, Steelband, Limbo, Parang, Rapso, Chutney-Soca, Soca, Jamoo, Panjazz and the Biggest, Best & Most Influential Caribbean Carnival in the World with no apology!
    Together We Aspire & Together We Achieve!!

  4. #4
    STEADY WUK Colors's Avatar Colors is offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    DEEP IN THE SOUTH
    Posts
    3,581
    Credits
    75,602,066
    1969 Garrot Bounce says it all for me.....I been saying it for years and years pun this site.......grandpa sounding good on the bass mehson

  5. #5
    Repect Our Soca Pioneers Socapro's Avatar Socapro is offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Soca Island
    Posts
    16,689
    Credits
    887,496,585
    Here is an earlier 1961 cover version of "Garrott Bounce" backed by the Cook Recording Orchestra from Trinidad made when the song first became a big hit throughout the Caribbean and announced Nelson's arrival on the Calypso map.

    Lord Nelson - Garrot Bounce (1961 Calypso)
    .

    And here is a related write up about Lord Nelson posted with the song:

    Lord Nelson is an innovator in the music field, who is regarded as an inventor and architect of soca music.
    His recordings are distinguished by their rhythmic complexity, variety in the integration of African, reggae and r&b in the pulse soca, arrangement and lyrics.

    Today as the composer of more than 300 calypsos, Nelson manages to constantly inject changes of sounds and rhythms in his soca. Nelson is a living legend who is ranked in the tradition of great calypsonians like the Mighty Sparrow and the late great Lord Kitchener. Born as Robert Nelson in Plymouth, Tobago, he emigrated to the United States as a teenager, so from early he was exposed to a variety of musical and cultural influences. He served in the war of Korea, where he did a bit of singing for his troops. In the late '50's he began playing with a steelband side from his State but singing took the centre stage because of the response of the general public.

    His encounter with Sparrow and Duke in 1963 influenced him to carve out a niche for himself in the world of Calypso. Duke was particularly inspired by Nelson.

    First shots of Nelson's calypsos had a unique sound, heavily influenced by American funk. Return Withers, Stella, King Liar, Baldhead Rasta and Disco Daddy, were also innovative and helped Nelson to be announced as a best loved calypsonian. He was also the first to introduce electronic instruments in his music. When it was decided that because he had become an American citizen, he was forbidden to compete in Trinidad & Tobago Calypso Monarch, Nelson was at the center of controversy. Nelson took everything in stride, breaking barriers with the calypso classic Foreigner.

    He finally wrote a top soca hit of the 20th century, covering carnivals throughout the Caribbean, United States and in England in 1983 and 1984. His postulate Mih Lover dominated the world's calypso and soca scene inviting people to "have a good good time." Worldwide audiences wanted Lord Nelson. Nelson was happy to oblige; with award-winning performances on the stages of London, Amsterdam, etc...
    Catch me as Soca PhD Every Saturday 2-4pm GMT
    On www.GenesisRadio.co.uk (91.6FM);
    Every Tueday 6-8pm & Friday 8-10pm GMT
    On www.HavitLive.co.uk (99.1FM);
    www.facebook.com/socaphd
    email: projampro@yahoo.co.uk

    Hailing from Trinidad & Tobago and very proud of it!!
    Land of Calypso, Steelband, Limbo, Parang, Rapso, Chutney-Soca, Soca, Jamoo, Panjazz and the Biggest, Best & Most Influential Caribbean Carnival in the World with no apology!
    Together We Aspire & Together We Achieve!!

  6. #6
    STEADY WUK Colors's Avatar Colors is offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    DEEP IN THE SOUTH
    Posts
    3,581
    Credits
    75,602,066
    This last version of Garrot Bounce sound more like calypso. ...the one with Milo and the Kings sound like soca

  7. #7
    Registered Member VINCYPOWA's Avatar VINCYPOWA is offline
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    ISLANDMIX DOT COM
    Posts
    89,597
    Credits
    46,676,994
    After WATCHING the INTERVIEW, I JUST SMILED.

    While these TRAUMATIZED TRINIS REGURGITATED what they were INDOCTRINATED to BELIEVE, I TOOK A TOTALLY DIFFERENT STANCE and APPROACH, because the SOUND SHEET that they were SINGING from was too SCRIPTED and too PACKAGED.

    Moreover, there were too MANY HOLES in the SCRIPT, especially coming from the LIPS of the fella CREDITED with the INVENTION of SOCA.

    The very first HOLE was the Indrani song.

    The second hole was SOKAH and what the KAH stands for.

    The third hole was SOCA is a MIXTURE of Indian RHYTHMS and CALYPSO.

    The FOURTH HOLE was SOCA is the SOUL of CALYPSO.

    The FIFTH HOLE was the MOST RETARDED of them all, taking the indian rhythms and transfered them to the DRUMSET.

    The SIXTH HOLE was this PHANTOM CLAIM that it was a REPORTER that changed the name of SOKAH to SOCA.

    There were so many holes in this ATTEMPT to make SOCA music a SOLELY TRINIDAD CREATION that it was AMAZING to me how many people fell for that story.

    I have always MAINTAIN that SOCA is SOUL and CALYPSO, because literally 99% of the songs of that era were a mixture of American SOUL, FUNK and DISCO music. Yet these FOOLS talked about these PHANTOM INDIAN RHYTHMS that could not be found in the VAST MAJORITY of the songs, even the very song that they claimed is the SOCA BEAT.

    That VERY BEAT can be found in American songs, especially the AMERICAN DOMINATED DISCO MUSIC, before the song by Shorty.

    Even the HORN SECTION of SOCA MUSIC is INFLUENCED by American FUNK music.

    But if you had LISTENED to these TRAUMATIZED TRINIS, who have been INDOCTRINATED to BELIEVE the MANUFACTURED STORY of the invention of SOCA, you would have sworn NONE of the CLEAR AMERICAN MUSIC INFLUENCES in SOCA MUSIC did not EXIST.

    They OH SO WANTED to BELIEVE that Trinidad invented a GENRE with no OUTSIDE INFLUENCES, by MARRYING the INFLUENCES of the TWO MAJOR ETHNIC GROUPS in that TWIN REPUBLIC, AFRO and INDO.

    FOOL AH TAWK BUT NUH FOOL AH LISSEN.

    With that, I REST MY CASE again.

    YUHHHHH SEEEEEE MEEEEEE
    Colors likes this.

  8. #8
    Repect Our Soca Pioneers Socapro's Avatar Socapro is offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Soca Island
    Posts
    16,689
    Credits
    887,496,585
    Quote Originally Posted by Colors View Post
    This last version of Garrot Bounce sound more like calypso. ...the one with Milo and the Kings sound like soca
    It’s not soca; it is just an uptempo Calypso leggo or jam back as the uptempo calypsos were sometimes referred to back then. "La La" and "Ah Ha" both arranged and backed by Art De Coteau which I also posted for your education are even faster calypsos than "Garrot Bounce" in the same calypso leggo/jam back vein.
    All those songs were regarded as uptempo calypsos in Trinidad when they came out rather than Soca because they were all still Calypsos based on their musical structure and those who understand the structure of calypso music will realize that.

    Soca is not just simply speeded up calypso (as you seem to believe) as we have always had faster calypsos (called leggos) even from in the 1950's especially during Carnival as played by most of the live brass bands on the road. This was before the era of the DJ’s dominating the road which started from the 1980’s and got worse in the 90’s when CD’s were introduced.

    Soca features a distinctive change in the beat and musical structure (which Lord Shorty introduce to the music in 1973) as compared with Calypso and you can have both faster as well as slower paced Soca music just like you can have faster as well as slower paced Calypso music.

    That is why Art De Coteau the most popular and respected calypso arranger in T&T during the late 60's to early 70's was initially resistant to Soca when Shorty introduced it in 1974 but was quite happy backing the uptempo calypsos by the top young calypsonians during the same period. Art De Coteau was only won over to joining the soca train around 1978 through working with Shadow whose move towards changing the traditional calypso beat in his music was more of a gradual change than we saw with Shorty, Maestro, Ed Watson and Pelham Goddard.

    Of the songs I posted above by Lord Nelson "Hot, Sweet & Jumpy" from 1978 is the only genuine soca track.
    The other hit tracks recorded by Nelson in the years prior are all uptempo calypsos and not soca.
    Soca has a different structure to calypso but only those who understand the different structure of both musical styles will realize this.

    Lord Nelson’s history in the music is very similar to King Wellington's. They both went to America as young calypsonians and experimented with fusing funk with their calypso and then with their soca music reflecting the strong American music influence of their environment.
    Saying that soul and funk was also very popular in T&T during the 1970's so young innovative calypsonians in Trinidad like Shorty and Maestro were also exposed to a similar music environment to those in America despite the vast physical distance between T&T and America.

    Here is a soca/calypso classic from Lord Nelson complaining about not being allowed to compete in T&T national Calypso competitions because he took up US citizenship. Those were in the days when T&T did not allow dual citizenship so when you gained US citizenship you had to give up your T&T citizenship.
    T&T has since changed the rules to allow dual citizenship but that came too late for the likes of Lord Nelson when he had passed the prime of his career.

    Lord Nelson - Foreigner (1978)


    Note this track which is arranged by Clive Bradley is a fusion of both soca and calypso and you can hear the switch between soca and calypso throughout the song when you listen to the change of the bass drum beat as well as the bass pattern. There were many hybrid soca/calypso tracks like this one in the late '70's after soca was introduced as it allowed the traditional calypso artists to get on the soca bandwagon without having to completely let go of the traditional calypso structure in their music which they were more accustomed to.

    And here is the title track "Black Gold" from the same album. Its a full blown soca track beautifully arrangement by Clive Bradley.

    Lord Nelson - Black Gold (1978)
    Catch me as Soca PhD Every Saturday 2-4pm GMT
    On www.GenesisRadio.co.uk (91.6FM);
    Every Tueday 6-8pm & Friday 8-10pm GMT
    On www.HavitLive.co.uk (99.1FM);
    www.facebook.com/socaphd
    email: projampro@yahoo.co.uk

    Hailing from Trinidad & Tobago and very proud of it!!
    Land of Calypso, Steelband, Limbo, Parang, Rapso, Chutney-Soca, Soca, Jamoo, Panjazz and the Biggest, Best & Most Influential Caribbean Carnival in the World with no apology!
    Together We Aspire & Together We Achieve!!

  9. #9
    STEADY WUK Colors's Avatar Colors is offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    DEEP IN THE SOUTH
    Posts
    3,581
    Credits
    75,602,066
    Socapro I think you miss the whole part of Lord Nelson interview......The way that you and many others for years stated shorty got the name SOCA from was not what Lord Nelson stated in the interview......with that I will continue to enjoy the sweet sounds of Garrot Bounce

  10. #10
    Repect Our Soca Pioneers Socapro's Avatar Socapro is offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Soca Island
    Posts
    16,689
    Credits
    887,496,585
    Quote Originally Posted by Colors View Post
    Socapro I think you miss the whole part of Lord Nelson interview......The way that you and many others for years stated shorty got the name SOCA from was not what Lord Nelson stated in the interview......with that I will continue to enjoy the sweet sounds of Garrot Bounce
    Nope, I listened quite attentively to Nelson's interview.

    He was indeed given the nickname of the Soul Calypsonian when he was performing regularly in America in the late 50's into the '60's after he served in the Korea war as he started out performing mostly covers of popular soul and calypso hits before learning to write his own Calypsos with the help of the Mighty Duke who mentored him from 1963 onwards.

    It is quite possible that Lord Nelson performed alongside Lord Shorty on one of the calypso shows during the T&T 1975 Carnival season as that was when Shorty's first major soca hit "Endless Vibrations" became massive and Shorty was in demand to perform his innovative ground-breaking soca anthem all over the place. So it is quite possible that Nelson may have suggested a name to Shorty for his new style of music before they both performed on the same calypso show in early 1975. Nelson did not say what year it was so I am logically speculating here if they meet before Shorty recorded his "Sweet Music" album in the latter part of 1975.

    The video which I added above (in post #2) with Pelham Goddard talking about how Shorty came up with the name Sokah/Soca for the new style of music in the latter half of 1975 could have been after Nelson performed alongside Shorty earlier that year so there might be some truth to what Lord Nelson said. However Lord Shorty aka Ras Shorty-I is no longer alive to confirm if it is true or not so we are just taking Lord Nelson’s word for it.

    PS:
    Take a listen to the two extra calypsos that I posted (in post #2) by Lord Nelson from 1972 and 1973 with much stronger funk elements than Nelson’s 1969 uptempo remake of “Garrot Bounce” and even those two tracks are still calypsos with funky bass lines and still not soca based on both tracks containing the traditional calypso drum beat. As I said speeding up a traditional calypso does not make it a soca as both genres have a different musical structure.
    Catch me as Soca PhD Every Saturday 2-4pm GMT
    On www.GenesisRadio.co.uk (91.6FM);
    Every Tueday 6-8pm & Friday 8-10pm GMT
    On www.HavitLive.co.uk (99.1FM);
    www.facebook.com/socaphd
    email: projampro@yahoo.co.uk

    Hailing from Trinidad & Tobago and very proud of it!!
    Land of Calypso, Steelband, Limbo, Parang, Rapso, Chutney-Soca, Soca, Jamoo, Panjazz and the Biggest, Best & Most Influential Caribbean Carnival in the World with no apology!
    Together We Aspire & Together We Achieve!!

  11. #11
    Registered User dedetriniking's Avatar dedetriniking is offline
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    19,912
    Credits
    48,509,228
    Just watched this and his last words say it all, "it belongs to me but I cannot prove it!".

    Bottom line for me is that Nelson made a massive contribution to the art form with some of the best party music ever made in the genre. Music that soca and calypso lovers will play forever. That is why i give him all the respect in the world.
    Socapro likes this.
    I hath 9 and 90 tribulations and nary a one doth concern a wench!

  12. #12
    Repect Our Soca Pioneers Socapro's Avatar Socapro is offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Soca Island
    Posts
    16,689
    Credits
    887,496,585
    Quote Originally Posted by dedetriniking View Post
    Just watched this and his last words say it all, "it belongs to me but I cannot prove it!".

    Bottom line for me is that Nelson made a massive contribution to the art form with some of the best party music ever made in the genre. Music that soca and calypso lovers will play forever. That is why i give him all the respect in the world.
    Could not have said it any better!

    And talking about party classics from Nelson check out this one composed by himself and Clive Bradley and played by Despers at the 1982 Panorama Finals.

    Lord Nelson - Ah Goin And Party Tonight (1981/82)


    And here is Desperadoes doing their live panorama rendition of Nelson's party classic in 1982.
    Beautiful arrangement!!

    Despers - Ah Goin And Party Tonight arr. Clive Bradley (1982 Panorama version)
    Catch me as Soca PhD Every Saturday 2-4pm GMT
    On www.GenesisRadio.co.uk (91.6FM);
    Every Tueday 6-8pm & Friday 8-10pm GMT
    On www.HavitLive.co.uk (99.1FM);
    www.facebook.com/socaphd
    email: projampro@yahoo.co.uk

    Hailing from Trinidad & Tobago and very proud of it!!
    Land of Calypso, Steelband, Limbo, Parang, Rapso, Chutney-Soca, Soca, Jamoo, Panjazz and the Biggest, Best & Most Influential Caribbean Carnival in the World with no apology!
    Together We Aspire & Together We Achieve!!

  13. #13
    Registered User dedetriniking's Avatar dedetriniking is offline
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    19,912
    Credits
    48,509,228
    Clive Bradley spent wayyyy too little time in recording songs before switching his energies to big steel bands. Most of Nelson's major hits were arranged by Bradley. Clearly a massive massive talent coalition when nelson and bradley were making music together.



    Socapro likes this.
    I hath 9 and 90 tribulations and nary a one doth concern a wench!

  14. #14
    Registered Member VINCYPOWA's Avatar VINCYPOWA is offline
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    ISLANDMIX DOT COM
    Posts
    89,597
    Credits
    46,676,994
    THE DEFINITIVE THREAD ON WHY SOCA IS SOUL AND CALYPSO.

    VINCYPOWA WILL MAKE THE CASE WHY SOCA IS SOUL n CALYPSO

  15. #15
    Registered User Seawall's Avatar Seawall is offline
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    maryland
    Posts
    4,328
    Credits
    11,321,991
    I've been collecting soca records from the mid 70's to the early 80's and the majority of them are straight Afro Caribbean. Whenever there's any Indian influence, it's usually melodic. As I've said before, Shorty's attempt with Indtani failed. He then retreated to the fusion of calypso, pan-Caribbean, and North American music which others like Wellington' and Shadow were doing. People have been posting more and more songs from that era on YouTube, so the evidence is there. Expect more challenges to the myth. One thing about Nelson, didn't Duke pen most of his songs.
    "Every onlooker is either a coward or a traitor." — Frantz Fanon

    “If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet depreciate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground. They want rain without thunder and lightning. They want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters.” Frederick Douglass

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •